Visa Extension
BySix months ago I reported on the process for renewing your VISA if you wish to stay in the country for more than 90 days. Since then I’ve learned about several expats who have gone native, which in this case means they just forget about the renewal altogether and go for years without addressing the issue. Assuming you don’t want to sneak across the Mexican border one day, you need this updated information.
I arrived at Migracion in the capital early so I could do the VISA process in one day. You see, if you complete all the paperwork by 10am, they will renew your passport and give it back at 3pm. (Yes, this is the same process that takes 5 minutes at the border). So I’m at migracion at 9am with my passports, those of the Wife and children, and even a few friends. I had completed the forms beforehand, made the copies of the passports, copies of the last page of entry stamps, copies of the credit card and brought passport sized photos of everyone involved. I had made sure this time to arrive before the 90 days expired, thus avoiding the 10Q per day per person fine for overstaying your VISA.
The same helpful senorita smiled and began explaining the items I would need. When she got to the end of the list she said, “When you were here last time did you have to bring your marriage license?” “No”, I replied. She then explained that El Presidente had fired her boss, and the new guy was enforcing all sorts of rules that had been on the books but not enforced for a long time. Thus, in addition to my marriage license, I needed to bring a copy of each kid’s birth certificate.
“And”, she continued, “right now we can’t process your renewal in anything less than 3 days, because of the new boss”.
Remembering the technique she used last time, I asked if I could go ahead and submit things now and bring the remaining papers back in three days when I came to pickup my stuff. She stood her ground and unfortunately said that was now impossible with the new jefe. At that moment I overheard a desperate gringo in the window next to me exclaiming “But I called you yesterday before I left Peten and you didn’t say anything about a birth certificate or marriage license.”
I glanced back at la senorita and raised an eyebrow. She grabbed the pile of passports and said she was going to go talk to the boss. Gringo from Peten didn’t get any help, his hombre just shrugged and motioned for the next guy. A few minutes later my girl returned and apologized curtly, and pushed the passports and all the paperwork back under the window.
I thought very seriously about explaining to her that Guatemala really should pay me to live here, promote expatism and employ people, but thought better of it. I stepped back from the window and tried to buy some time to think of creative solutions when I heard a Chapin explaining a nightmare story that helps to put mine in perspective. Apparently this guy married a Filipino woman while they were both in the US. Now he’s here trying to get her residency, but there is no Filipino embassy in Guatemala, so they sent him to El Salvador, but there is no embassy there either. So they were telling this guy to fly to Japan to get her paperwork completed! In the meantime, her VISA has expired and apparently it’s not easy for Asians to cross borders in Central America, so she’s really in a bind.
Proof that government bureaucracies function the same regardless of other cultural differences.
So as of today, here’s what you need to renew:
1. Passport with a entrance stamp
2. Complete the form.
3. Two copies of the front/photo page of your passport.
4. One copy of the most recent stamp of entry.
5. Copy of front and back of a foreign credit card (they check the expiration date, btw).
6. If you are married, a copy of your marriage license.
7. If you have a child you are renewing, a copy of their birth certificate.
8. Passport sized photos of anyone renewing.
I strongly urge you to call before you go though, and to call twice in an attempt to get two different people so you can double your chances of getting accurate information. Regardless, take at minimum everything listed above, plus lots of small bills for the fotocopia guy upstairs.
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25 Comments
March 4th, 2010 at 6:28 pm
thanks for the helpful info Mark! It seems paperwork is always changing. I know we've got to do some paperwork at their Consulate in Providence, RI and then go to Palencia when we get there so Jose can get his documents in order. Apparently his ex wife never knew they'd divorced back in 1997 (he sent her paperwork, but she claims she never got it. She signed for it, but I assume since it was in English, she couldn't read it! And before some of your readers get into a tizzy about a Gringa stealing a poor Guatemalteca's spouse while he was here in the US trying to send home the bacon, they should realize that after he'd been gone a year she suddenly had a bun in the oven and tried to convince him that she got that way by all the letters he was sending her! um, right…. ) So now she can't register the 2 new additions to her family because documents still show them as legally married there… in addition to the son she produced via King Express who still needs to be registered, lol. So that will be one order of business when we go there, it will be interesting to see how their local offices handle taking her off, adding me on as the "new wife" and adding our daughter to the mix as well. I have to admit, I would have loved to have been there when he got the call from her at his mother's over the holidays and she asked him for a divorce.
))
March 4th, 2010 at 9:11 pm
When I got my residency a few years ago I was so excited that I was jumping for joy. My friends in the States thought I had lost my mind getting excited about Guatemalan residency since I am a US citizen. I was excited because I feel a deep love for Guatemala, my daughters are both Guatemalan and I live and work with Guatemalan children and it felt only right that I have my residency. It also made me feel better when I was in court and all the lawyers and government officials toss, in a pile, their identification and mine is a cedula and not a US passport.
After reading your list of documents needed to renew a stay in Guatemala I am thrilled to have my residency. I do have a question. Do the documents have to be legally translated? If not, why couldn't someone just make up their own birth and marriage certificates? As far as I remember, all legal documents that are not issued within Guatemala, must be registered with the ministry of exterior relations after being translated into Spanish. My other question would be how current do they need the documents issuance date? I have many years of experience dealing with Guatemalan bureaucracy and all the above were issues in any legal document. Not trying to add fuel to the fire but just wonder how "legal" they want the birth and marriage certificates.
March 4th, 2010 at 11:10 pm
With the laundry list of things needed just to renew your visa, have you considered just getting residency? It doesn't require much more than what you have listed, and the best part is that you only have to do it once. It doesn't require a lawyer, just some trips to visit your friends at Migracion and a bit of patience. And having a cedula (soon to be DPI) in hand is well worth the effort. It sure beats the every-six-month hassle.
March 5th, 2010 at 2:40 am
Ugh. That sucks. I feel compelled to point out that dealing with USCIS in the U.S. before my husband got his citizenship was no picnic either. I am reliving the "joys" of immigration now that my brother married a Japanese woman and a friend just got engaged to a Filipina woman.
Here are some of the reasons why it's a headache to deal with USCIS:
–If you want to talk to someone on the phone, you often have to be on hold for over an hour
–If you want to talk to someone in person, you must travel to your nearest office (which could be a 7-hour drive from where you live). Plus, you must schedule an appointment online and you must present a printout of your appointment confirmation in order to get in the door.
–Filing fees are very expensive.
–Ah, but you may say, "well at least in the US they don't change the rules on you". WRONG. I can think of two instances (both in our case and another couple) where the filing fee was a certain amount of money when we MAILED the forms, but by the time they actually opened the envelopes several weeks later, the filing fee had increased. They mailed everything back to us and we had to file again.
March 5th, 2010 at 5:52 pm
We were just talking about this in my house…. I'm going to share this information with my friends here in Guate. Thanks for the info… hope you and the fam are doing well.
March 6th, 2010 at 2:54 pm
Well, you must be pleased at least that the rules are being followed.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:50 pm
Based on stories I've heard, I would expect 3-5 years to clear that up.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:52 pm
Nancy, I like the way your dirty little mind works. There appears to be no verification at all of any of the paperwork. I know of expats who have submitted copies of credit cards that were never activated, and all of the identity papers could easily be forged. Nothing is being translated into Spanish either. All signs are they are trying to prevent people from staying here in Guate on a stolen passport. Not like it's difficult to just go to the border and get your stamp though, so it really just increases the burden on the rest of us.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:55 pm
The $1400 per person fee is one reason to not get residency. I asked the lawyer, "So other than not having to renew my visa at the cost of 120Q every 90 days (or leaving the country at no cost), what am I actually getting for my $1400?" His response: "That's a good question". Maybe you have a better answer.
That's one strike against residency. The other is the dozens of stories I have heard of 2, 3, 4 and 5 year sagas of people trying to get their residency done and having paperwork rejected, rules changed, paperwork lost, and lots of wasted money only to get nothing in the end because someone is incompetent, ignorant or corrupt.
So for now I'd say, no, that nightmare doesn't sound like it's better than a 3 day vacation to Mexico, which is my new plan.
March 8th, 2010 at 3:57 pm
I don't know, this is Guate man, nobody follows the rules here. I'm not sure how to feel about it now.
March 8th, 2010 at 8:28 pm
Wow, $1400 per person! I guess that's a lawyer’s price and includes his fees, since the Migracion web page quotes $500 as the highest fee for PR visa. http://bit.ly/aLJhdA
For someone wanting residency, as long as their income comes from outside Guatemala, the cost paid to Migracion is $0. The PR classification is ‘Pensioner, Investor, or income from rental’. http://bit.ly/b0aB2F This category is FREE, but doesn't allow legal employment within Guatemala (same as the 90 day tourist visa).
I did the process myself. The application and list of requirements are short. The process was 6 months, although it would have been faster if I had a car to get into the city. Also, no visa renewal needed while ‘in process’. Dealing directly with Migracion was fairly easy. I even emailed the officer handling my case to confirm what I had was correct before I made the trip into town.
Most of the ugly stories that I have heard about the corruption, delays, etc involved attorneys, who ended up being the problem and then they covered their tracks by placing blame on the government office. Easy fix, get rid of the middle man.
Everyone has a different situation, but many people give up before they even begin. It took some digging to find out what I needed to complete the process, but it started with discovering that I could do it myself. No one wants you to know that because it means lost revenue for those involved. But then you lose a great excuse for a Mexico vacation every 3 months!
March 9th, 2010 at 4:49 am
We will be turning in our paperwork to get our residency visas in April. The cost will be $1500 for the 4 of us (2 adults and 2 kids). That is paid to the Tramitador in Guate so that we don’t have to do all of the traveling. The paperwork seems pretty straightforward and the process should take 6 months, although I have friends for whom it’s taken 2 years. The downside is that if there is a reason you need to leave the country during that time, you can’t (death in the family, medical emergency etc.) That’s why we waited until after our kids were born and hopefully we’ll have our paperwork before the next one(s) come(s) along.
Another benefit is that you get to bring in a onetime shipment of goods and not pay import taxes on them. If you bring in a container, that can save you a bunch of money. Also, you can open bank accounts and take out loans without the need for a Guatemalan to recommend you. It makes other things easier as well, such as buying property, or anything else involving the law. Everything gets a little trickier and less secure when you are just a “Tourist” trying to do all of those things.
June 10th, 2010 at 1:12 am
Be careful with the photos.. I saw many frustrated people there the last two days!
They dont accept standard Fuji, Quickphoto prints. Only photos on special analog papertype are accepted.
They can give you (if you ask) a list of 4 studios who can make this type of photos.
July 19th, 2010 at 10:08 pm
I have been in Guatemala for about 5 months with an expired tourist visa ( I am a US cit) and cannot afford to pay that ridiculous 10Q (I do FREE medical work as part of a missionary program in secluded villages). What are my alternatives? Can I pay to get a stamp at Belize or Mex? Or go to Mex (which I am near to) and somehow get to it avoiding Immigration and then coming back to Guate for a stamp? (Never thought Id be illegaly entering mexico for my benefit) Any suggestions? Please? PLEASE?! Thank you!
July 20th, 2010 at 3:29 am
Joe,
Illegally entering Mexico would not help you get back into Guatemala. It would probabally make your situation all the more complex. Southern Mexico, even in good times is not some place I would want to be caught 'illegally'.
You would probabally be much better off to tell the head of your service organization your situation, and see if a proverbial 'hat' could be passed among the expat missionary community, to help pay the fine, and enable you to regain legal status. Guatemala is not the US, and you really don't have a voice on how the country is run. The US expects guests to behave according to it's law, so it's only right that American's respect the law when they travel outside of their country.
And, on a personal note, please try to be a little more careful about telling the world who you are. I am only a regular guest on Mark's blog, like everybody else, but you left so many clues that it took about 30 seconds with a broken wrist to find out that your last name starts with the letter "M", your home address contains the number "616", your phone number in the US contains "818", and your luggage probabally has items in it which might be used on a professional basis in Guatemala, which could be used to deny you entrance to the country, unless you had a work visa. If your situation isn't entirely legal, a whole lot of "CYA" is a good thing. You don't know who is watching, and not commenting.
July 20th, 2010 at 2:27 pm
Levi, would you please consider moving to Guatemala so that we can figure out the other 99% of unsolved crimes?
July 20th, 2010 at 6:09 pm
Christina,
Real criminals rarely leave so many clues…
(Although, there was the guy who broke into my car a few months back, and left his wallet.) All information I gave Joe above is easily accessible by anyone reading this blog, with remarkably little effort. While I understand Joe feeling uncomfortable with his situation, I do feel there might have been other ways of soliciting free advice. While Mark is a busy man, I can personally attest to the fact that he does respond well to private email, for example. I am also very aware that if the situation were reversed, and Joe were Guatemalan, and overstayed his (overpriced) tourist visa in the United States, his situation would be a lot more unpleasant.
July 20th, 2010 at 2:47 pm
Joe,
Just fly out. Nobody checks your passport stamp. Get a round trip on Spirit to Miami for one of their $89 sales, don’t take a bag and you’ll get off cheap. I was over by one day once and was prepared for a trip to immigration if needed, but you can fly out and come back without any trouble.
July 20th, 2010 at 9:04 pm
Jimmy, I think he'd be in for a big surprise; they don't check the stamp because there's a record in the computer and when they swipe the passport it shows up with the last date of entry/exit and computes for them whether you've overstayed your visa.
July 21st, 2010 at 2:38 am
You obviously know nothing about Guatemala. Spare us your inane lectures. Getting back on topic, thats what they recommended to me at the immigration office here Sweaty Peten I am just afraid of losing my flight because of that. But thank you all, the ones who know what they are talking about and are not trying to massage their internet egos, for the input. Does anyone know if coming back into guatemala without an exit stamp poses a problem? Thanks again!
July 21st, 2010 at 5:14 am
Joe, in all honesty, I probabally dealt with Guatemalan immigration before you were born, and have done so many times since. I'm also a Mexican by birth. I tried to be gentle. It's not Guatemala's fault you're in the country illegally. It's your fault. Take responsibility for your actions, face the consequences, and move on with your life. Am I missing something in this conversation?
And, as far as "internet egos" go… I'm not the one running a bedroom "web design studio" with a website with security so laughable it's almost painful to discuss. With all sincerity… You are a very talented photographer, and in that field, you'll do very well. Stick to what you do best.
July 21st, 2010 at 10:58 am
Mark, I have gone and come and had no problem when flying. They do not swipe when you leave on a flight, so how would the record be updated for the thousands that fly out every day?
My passport was stolen, so I got a new one, but with no stamps. When I tried to cross at Belize, they told me that I was 3 months over my stay and would need to go to Guate along with my wife who was 3 days over. We flew out, came back a month later, and have had no problems through several border crossings since then in Belize and arriving at the airport.
July 21st, 2010 at 5:07 pm
Well, I'm baffled; I've seen them swipe and seen the data on the computer screen and had a migracion guy point out how 'the wonderful machine calculates the days for us'. I've also had friends not get their exit stamps at the airport and have trouble re-entering because the computer showed they had never left…Oh well…it is Guatemala after all.
July 29th, 2010 at 2:26 pm
Sweaty when is the last time you left? I am going to try this as the days keep racking up and by the time we leave for our honeymoon itll be about 6 months past
I wonder if marrying her will help me with the residency. Does anyone know about that?
July 29th, 2010 at 2:30 pm
guateliving I dont have your email. What is it?